Warrior General Games

These guides are for use with the € Rebel Alliance € Dot Starter Guide http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=5009067

You'll get specifics on what height and or weight to start with, and what attribute you want to shoot up to the second cap. Then the guide will lay out a rough plan for what to do with your first season, and then some vague ideas on how the rest of the build should go.

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As Rebel Leader, and Chief Engineering Officer for the entire Evil Empire, I do hereby officially denounce the Return Man archetype.

There is only one reason not to use an Elusive HB as your teams' return man. That reason is flex cost. If you cannot find someone willing to spring for the cost of building a fully boosted and equipped HB return man, then the second best option is to find someone to build, boost, and equip a Rushing FB. In addition to cost, there are other advantages of going with a FB over a HB. The HB is more likely to break a big play, but the FB is less likely to fumble.

For comparison sake only, I will build a Return Man CB, as an example of what not to do. Since the Returner archetype has the same ALGs for every position the same build could be used on HBs and WRs.

Then we'll compare the ending numbers to the HB and FB from their respective build threads.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=5018976&page=1#46630522
and
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=5018977&page=1#46630528

Returner (HB/WR/CB eligible)

Bonus SA: Return Specialist, Spin, Juke, Cover up

Height: Minimum for +2 Agility. Weight: Minimum for +2 Speed.

Big 3: Speed, Agility, Carry

Starting Build: 25 (27) Speed, 16 (18) Agility

Because you start out with 27 in Speed, you'll only need to buy +10% enhancement to start with. By Day 48 you'll be able to buy 1 SP and cap Speed at 49. Keep pounding Speed, and on Day 0 you be able to 2-cap Speed at 61.50. That same day, you'll be able to buy Speed Multi-training, and start training Agility on the swing attribute. Because you skimped on your Speed enhancement, you can also buy the Agility enhancement at +20% at the same time. Then on Day 2 go ahead and pick up the +20% enhancement for Speed.

Day 9/10: You'll 3-cap Speed. Keep on double training.

Day 17/18: You'll 4-cap Speed, and be done with it Keep on double training.

Day 25/26: You'll cap Agility at 49.80. Now start up your 4-way training. Unlock Agility and Carrying multi-training, and then buy the 10% enhancements for both carrying and Vision.

** Note: This is one of the few builds where it doesn't make a big difference if you boost early or not. So on Day 32 you can boost twice and 2-cap Agility. This will also allow you to get your L16 Equipment upgrades.

Then wait as long as possible, ideally day 48, to use your last boost. You'll also want to bring Carrying and Agility enhancements up to the 30% mark. You'll need them later so might as well buy them now.

Here's where we're at so far...

Player Build
Position: cb_returner
Season: 2
Day: 48
Boosts: 6
Level: 19
XP: 0
VA XP: 0
VA: 0
Bonus Tokens: 19
Training Points: 4
SP: 12

Training Status:
strength : 0%
speed : 10%
agility : 71%
jumping : 0%
stamina : 0%
vision : 80%
confidence : 0%
blocking : 0%
throwing : 0%
catching : 0%
carrying : 37%
tackling : 0%
kicking : 0%
punting : 0%

Attributes:
strength : 13.94
speed : 78.2
agility : 63.2
jumping : 13.94
stamina : 21.2
vision : 20.2
confidence : 15.94
blocking : 6
throwing : 8
catching : 8
carrying : 22.2
tackling : 8
kicking : 8
punting : 8

Hang onto your boosts.

Day 0: Your training should have rolled over so that you can 3-cap Agility without having to boost.

Day 10: You hit L22, you should be able to buy 1 SP and 4-cap Agility, and then boost up to L25 to get your VXP started.

Day 13/14: You finally be able to 5-cap Agility and be done with it.

Player Build
Position: cb_returner
Season: 3
Day: 14
Boosts: 9
Level: 26
XP: 200
VA XP: 600
VA: 2
Bonus Tokens: 76
Training Points: 2
SP: 8

Training Status:
strength : 0%
speed : 70%
agility : 82%
jumping : 0%
stamina : 0%
vision : 13%
confidence : 0%
blocking : 0%
throwing : 0%
catching : 0%
carrying : 20%
tackling : 0%
kicking : 0%
punting : 0%

Attributes:
strength : 15.85
speed : 80.5
agility : 77.5
jumping : 15.85
stamina : 23.5
vision : 28.5
confidence : 17.85
blocking : 6
throwing : 8
catching : 8
carrying : 30.5
tackling : 8
kicking : 8
punting : 8

So now we need a good dose of Carrying (6-cap to be safe), then we'll hit Vision and Stamina with a double cap each before digging into Strength. Then we'll want to 1-cap Confidence just to help avoid the possible downward morale spiral that a fumble could cause. Jumping gets ignored in this build. We'll do 4 AEQ for the +58 which we'll stack in Speed. Light Training will have to start around Age 160 and you do heavy doses of agility and carrying, in addition to bringing your other attributes up to the 95%+ range.

So here's what I was able to come up with...

Player Value Calculator
Player Value = 1298.94

Player Build
Position: cb_returner
Season: 9
Day: 1
Boosts: 30
Level: 79
XP: 0
VA XP: 600
VA: 72
Bonus Tokens: 1493
Training Points: 0
SP: 54

Training Status:
strength : 1%
speed : 1%
agility : 6%
jumping : 0%
stamina : 3%
vision : 1%
confidence : 5%
blocking : 0%
throwing : 0%
catching : 0%
carrying : 0%
tackling : 0%
kicking : 0%
punting : 0%

Attributes:
strength : 75
speed : 95.32 (153)
agility : 93.32
jumping : 25
stamina : 65.38
vision : 66.37
confidence : 52
blocking : 6
throwing : 8
catching : 8
carrying : 91.35
tackling : 8
kicking : 8
punting : 8

Top SA Tree: | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 |
Bottom SA Tree: | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 |
Additional SA Tree: | 0 |

With mere 54 SPs left for SAs

Top SA Tree: | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 |
Bottom SA Tree: | 9(10) | 5(6) | 8(9) | 0(1) | 0(1) |
Additional SA Tree: | 0(12) | Spin

AEQ should go 15% Break Tackle, 15% Anti-Fumble, 2 pieces of +6 Spin.

This is why CBs don't really make good return men. They don't really have access to all the SAs that it takes to be a good one.

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So now let's take a look at that HB again, and re-work the SAs to include Return Specialist.

Player Value Calculator
Player Value = 1390.48

Player Build
Position: hb_elusive_back
Season: 9
Day: 1
Boosts: 30
Level: 79
XP: 0
VA XP: 600
VA: 72
Bonus Tokens: 1539
Training Points: 0
SP: 56

Training Status:
strength : 4%
speed : 1%
agility : 2%
jumping : 0%
stamina : 4%
vision : 5%
confidence : 73%
blocking : 0%
throwing : 0%
catching : 0%
carrying : 3%
tackling : 0%
kicking : 0%
punting : 0%

Attributes:
strength : 81.26
speed : 99.06 (157)
agility : 95.06
jumping : 6
stamina : 62.26
vision : 65.06
confidence : 33.26
blocking : 6
throwing : 8
catching : 22.26
carrying : 92.07
tackling : 8
kicking : 8
punting : 8

So SAs were...
Top SA Tree: | 3 | 6 | 3 | 6 | 7 |
Bottom SA Tree: | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 |
Additional SA Tree: | 1 | OFF

Lets adjust that to...
Top SA Tree: | 2(3) | 4(11) | 2(3) | 4(11) | 7(8) |
Bottom SA Tree: | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 |
Additional SA Tree: | 7 | Return Specialist

Then you have 4 AEQs to work with. 15% Fake, 15% Anti-Fumble, +6 Head Fake, and +6 Juke. With CEQ, that becomes 21% Fake or +12% Break Tackle, with 11s in both HF and Juke, and you have a 8 in Spin to boot.

Not only does the HB have much better attributes, he's much more elusive because of his variety of SAs. Plus, he'll be less prone to fumble due to better Strength, Carrying and SAs.

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Now let's take a look at what the FB brings to the table...

Player Value Calculator
Player Value = 1445.49

Player Build
Position: fb_rusher
Season: 9
Day: 1
Boosts: 30
Level: 79
XP: 75
VA XP: 600
VA: 72
Bonus Tokens: 1283
Training Points: 0
SP: 80

Training Status:
strength : 2%
speed : 1%
agility : 2%
jumping : 4%
stamina : 5%
vision : 0%
confidence : 0%
blocking : 0%
throwing : 0%
catching : 18%
carrying : 1%
tackling : 0%
kicking : 0%
punting : 0%

Attributes:
strength : 95.07
speed : 81.26 (136)
agility : 97.06
jumping : 50
stamina : 51.26
vision : 51.26
confidence : 40.06
blocking : 20.26
throwing : 8
catching : 21
carrying : 96.06
tackling : 8
kicking : 8
punting : 8

Top SA Tree: | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 |
Bottom SA Tree: | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 |
Additional SA Tree: | 0 | 0 |

So the SAs were...
| 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 |
| 4(5) | 3(4) | 6(13) | 4(5) | 4(5) |
| 6(12) | 10 | Spin | Hurdle |

We change that to...
Top SA Tree: | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 |
Bottom SA Tree: | 9(10) | 3(4) | 4(11) | 4(5) | 0(1) |
Additional SA Tree: | 10 | 5(11) | Return Specialist | Spin |

The AEQ doesn't really need to change... the 3 AEQs would be +15% BT, +6 Spin, +6 Power Thru. I'd use the CEQ bonus to hit 21% BT

So at the cost of pure break away speed (153 to 136 = 17 lost) you gain a metric butt ton of fumble resistance. Not only does the FB have much more Strength, Carrying, and weight to him (all of which reduce fumble chances) is very easy for him to stock up on Cover Up which is an amazingly nice bonus to Fumble Avoidance. On top of all of that, remember that Fumble chance is increased by the excess amount of the make-tackle roll. So with the stack of Break Tackle gear, the FB is also reducing as much of any "excess make-tackle chance" as humanly possible.

Not to mention, if the build were planned as a 4 AEQ build, there would be less of a Speed difference and another Tackle Breaker opens up with Hurdle gear.

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That's why the Returner archetype is a waste of time. Why would you do a 5 ALG HB (+0.4) when you could do a 4 (+0.5)? Then why would you do a WR of any type, when you could do a HB for the same flex cost? The Returner CB is the only one worth even considering, and that's if you're short on flex. But he'll be so mediocre compared to the HB that it really isn't worth it. At least with the FB (for the same price as the CB) you get an incredible boost in reliability.

reserved for commentary

I was told vision was once very important but now it is more 4-5 range. Carrying is suppose to be better because it helps you avoid fumbles so it's 3rd. They say returners can find holes pretty fine without a lot of vision and too much vision can lead to glitches, like jumping side to side or running backwards. I can post the glitches if you want me to find them again.
Also where's stamina? Let the chatting begin.

ZOMG some signs of life

unfortunately this thread hasn't been re-written yet, and is in the old format--but I'll take what I can get.

for the record, I'm of the opinion that the era of specialty return men has come and gone. I would rather see an extra HB, or even FB pick-up:

Originally posted by
Return Specialist
This player is very adept at returning kicks and punts. The Return Specialist skill gives him a bonus to speed, agility, and tackle avoidance when returning kicks.

This skill is very important for players who return kicks or punts.

Additional Levels:
Increases the bonuses when returning kicks and punts.
as the bonus SA
and
Originally posted by
Return Man
This player returns kicks intelligently and avoids mistakes. When playing KR/PR, each level of Return Man gives a +3% bonus to vision, a +2% bonus to the success rate of Juke, Spin and Head Fake, and a 2% bonus to avoiding fumbles.

Special Teamer
Special teams is 1/3 of the game. Each level of Special Teamer gives a +1% bonus to all attributes when playing on either side on kickoffs and punts, except for K/P.
for VAs

that's pretty much all that's different when making a specific built return man.... other than the fact that the ALGs are worse for the HB Return Man Archetype. The WR Return Man at least doesn't lose anything in ALGs. If someone wanted to do a CB (for some reason other than the fact that it was the cheapest) then the Return Archetype is the only way to get access to Carry which is amazingly important.

But, yeah, if I were building the ultimate dream team, I'd just make another Elusive HB and give him the above SA and VAs and use him in the rotation for HBs as usual.
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=5018976&page=1#46630522
This guy would do just fine as a return man, he'd just have a different bonus SA and he'd spend his SAs a little differently, to allow for an investment in that bonus SA.
If I were going cheap, I'd just do a FB, and live without the insane speed
http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=5018977&page=1#46630528

As for attributes, Carry is definitely more important than Vision. For me personally, I think could be the #2 attribute, and should definitely be in the 90s. All the pretty returns in the world are negated by fumbles.

Oh... and just one more little thing...

Success on special teams is more about the set up of blocking units. All of the best Return men in the history of GLB have had specially designed blocking dots.
Case in point...

the current top ranked active return man is Crazy Crevva
http://goallineblitz.com/game/hof.pl?all_time=1&type=st
then if you check out his team's special teams list
http://goallineblitz.com/game/depth_chart.pl?team_id=704§ion=steams
he also owns every player, and they only play special teams. There's a mix of STOP o-linemen and purpose built defensive players like
http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=2355815
this 250 pound DT

why? I have no idea what advantage a 250 pound DT could bring over a 250 pound DE.
here's a power CB http://goallineblitz.com/game/player.pl?player_id=1989925 which he has 3 of. Why not a power FS or a combo SS or anything else? I have no idea
but you can't argue with 91 career forced fumbles and 21 in the past 2 seasons alone.

If you total up his 3 Power CBs they have 305 career forced fumbles, with 66 in the past 2 seasons. [This is why carry is so important] Who knows how many points that has lead to for his team, either direct on fumble returns for TDs, or indirectly by giving the offense amazing field position.