Originally posted by Octowned
Originally posted by Jack Del Rio

Get crackin', Octowned.

I'm not sure if I have the energy to go through all of it again More than just the o-line bars changed. It is a lot of work to figure these out... MUCH more work than it takes Bort to change them, lol.

He had to keep you guessing lol. I feel your pain though, a lot of it is out the window unless you can find a single change to every bar, ie. confidence removed or something along those lines.

Originally posted by Bort
Originally posted by reddogrw

Originally posted by Bort


Originally posted by tautology




Bort: Any thought about including a pass block vs run block bar for the team overall ratings?



Suppose; it would mess up the symmetry though.

did you change ALL the bars?

Possibly; one of the formulas that goes into many of the bars got updated because I noticed it was a fair bit out of date based on the current sim.

Interesting, I didn't know there were common "pieces" across the bars, we've treated each bar independently. I have a feeling this is why some of the bars we're trying to crack have given us AWFUL denominators (over 50), whereas others are quite simple.

Originally posted by Octowned
Originally posted by Jack Del Rio

Get crackin', Octowned.

I'm not sure if I have the energy to go through all of it again More than just the o-line bars changed. It is a lot of work to figure these out... MUCH more work than it takes Bort to change them, lol.

Hey Octowned. I have a suspicion that there are new variables. My guess is player level. I could be wrong but I noticed that lower leveled players that had high bars dropped while high leveled players with bars lower than the low leveled players with high bars had an increase in their scouting bars. If that makes sense. Or I could be way off.

Originally posted by blln4lyf
Originally posted by Octowned

Originally posted by Jack Del Rio


Get crackin', Octowned.

I'm not sure if I have the energy to go through all of it again More than just the o-line bars changed. It is a lot of work to figure these out... MUCH more work than it takes Bort to change them, lol.

He had to keep you guessing lol. I feel your pain though, a lot of it is out the window unless you can find a single change to every bar, ie. confidence removed or something along those lines.

That's okay, it was just a neat project for me while studying Statistics, doing some regression analysis and stuff. I've got more important things to worry about now like... finding a job in this economy :X:X:X

Ah yes, and my C is 78 run blocking! Before this, finding a gold C bar was deemed nearly impossible on a good build (only way before was a crazy high blocking build), now I guess it is commonplace.

Originally posted by Octowned
Ah yes, and my C is 78 run blocking! Before this, finding a gold C bar was deemed nearly impossible on a good build (only way before was a crazy high blocking build), now I guess it is commonplace.

your C isn't gold bar on my end, he's a 78 but still solid green

and yes, the formulas will probably never make any sense. Doesn't seem like any LB's will ever get higher than like 72 if they're lucky. If they are based on 100, then it's sort of lame that 10 year tenured players who are great builds can't even come close to 90's. Maybe that is just how Bort wants it, but it still doesn't make sense.

And they should go up by 1 at a time rather than 3 at a time. LOL @ scouting bars

Random fact: They DO go up by 1 for the QB's passing bar.

In case you didn't notice

We have a script that collects every build from the marketplace then runs a regression analysis on it. This isn't usually how I like to do work, but in the interest of publishing something relative....


run blocking

~ 0.4 strength
~0.175 vision
~0.125 agility
~0.1 blocking
~0.05 speed
~0.05 confidence
weight factor


pass blocking

mixed strength results (0-0.15)
0.1-0.2 speed
0.25-0.3 agility
~0.2 vision
all showed very low (0-0.1) blocking




The pass blocking bar results were awful, but across all three positions the run blocking looked pretty solid (and made sense). Low blocking, high vision, meh, not going to claim it is true, but clearly strength got a big boost, blocking went way down, and speed is in there now. Pass blocking who knows, the results had huge error.

It kind of sucks. I was building a player to the old bars and now blocking is a non factor. I wonder why I have 80 in blocking on my G now if it has no value?

Originally posted by AngryDragon
It kind of sucks. I was building a player to the old bars and now blocking is a non factor. I wonder why I have 80 in blocking on my G now if it has no value?

Yep, no kidding. I 4th capped blocking on my lvl 22 Guard and he's already up to 78.xx almost 79.

Really wish I would have just started with strength. It makes no sense the way Bort is using Blocking, imo.

It's turning into a secondary skill, because all you really need are Strength/Agility with some Vision and Confidence.

Sure, you can't get away with NO blocking, but if you eventually 3rd cap, that seems to be all you need, maybe mix in some Great Blocker.

meh.bleh.blah.

Originally posted by Octowned
Random fact: They DO go up by 1 for the QB's passing bar.

In case you didn't notice

You know what? I did notice that last night. How friggin' random is that?

I guess it has to do with the way the majority of players build O linemen and the training combos. Then there are the VAs and SAs. Not many if any give a bonus to strength but almost all give a bonus to blocking. So I am guessing the way to build O linemen is to make them crazy strong and just enough blocking to multiply well with all the potential bonuses gained from SAs and VAs. This will leave more time to spend SP in other skills such as speed, agility and vision.

Thats my guess. It still sucks since some were building according to the old bars.

I know the NFL is a bad example but it is what many players try to model their players after. Basically there are strong blockers and technicians in the NFL. I guess GLB will only have strong blockers from now on. Also the difference between a lineman who can block and one that can't in the NFL is a CFL career. It is that simple. All college linemen can usually runblock. If they don't learn how to pass block in the NFL their teammates make fun of them and they join the CFL or become trash men.

Originally posted by teamriots
Originally posted by AngryDragon

It kind of sucks. I was building a player to the old bars and now blocking is a non factor. I wonder why I have 80 in blocking on my G now if it has no value?

Yep, no kidding. I 4th capped blocking on my lvl 22 Guard and he's already up to 78.xx almost 79.

Really wish I would have just started with strength. It makes no sense the way Bort is using Blocking, imo.

It's turning into a secondary skill, because all you really need are Strength/Agility with some Vision and Confidence.

Sure, you can't get away with NO blocking, but if you eventually 3rd cap, that seems to be all you need, maybe mix in some Great Blocker.

meh.bleh.blah.

Same.

But it will be no problem. With the 30+ SP you can assign from equipment ultimately these type of builds should still be good.

Originally posted by AngryDragon
I guess it has to do with the way the majority of players build O linemen and the training combos. Then there are the VAs and SAs. Not many if any give a bonus to strength but almost all give a bonus to blocking. So I am guessing the way to build O linemen is to make them crazy strong and just enough blocking to multiply well with all the potential bonuses gained from SAs and VAs. This will leave more time to spend SP in other skills such as speed, agility and vision.

Thats my guess. It still sucks since some were building according to the old bars.

I know the NFL is a bad example but it is what many players try to model their players after. Basically there are strong blockers and technicians in the NFL. I guess GLB will only have strong blockers from now on. Also the difference between a lineman who can block and one that can't in the NFL is a CFL career. It is that simple. All college linemen can usually runblock. If they don't learn how to pass block in the NFL their teammates make fun of them and they join the CFL or become trash men.

The run blocking bar is a combination of several abilities, kinda averaged out (the ability to engage/hold, the ability to push him around, the ability to get to your man). STR is more important in pushing your guy around, blocking more important in holding onto the block. In the bar, they're about equal I suppose.

Don't use the bar as your end-all of building your player. It's supposed to be a general idea of how good a player probably is at doing something.

In other words, the formulas in game haven't changed. The output for the bars have.

Originally posted by Bort

The run blocking bar is a combination of several abilities, kinda averaged out (the ability to engage/hold, the ability to push him around, the ability to get to your man). STR is more important in pushing your guy around, blocking more important in holding onto the block. In the bar, they're about equal I suppose.

Don't use the bar as your end-all of building your player. It's supposed to be a general idea of how good a player probably is at doing something.

In other words, the formulas in game haven't changed. The output for the bars have.

Ah, but you said that bars were changed because "I noticed it was a fair bit out of date based on the current sim". So what's different?