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thehazyone
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Originally posted by PP
Originally posted by hud


Sorry no quote, but he did say that the level of your player affected what kind of equipment came up in the store.


Thanks for clearing that up. The fact that I didn't know this is a huge prob, IMO. I know that there are players that spend way more time scouring the forums than I do, but there are 10000-100000000 more that spend far less time. I try pretty damn hard to find and piece together everything Bort has to say about this game, and still was way off base on that. When I answer ?s, I try to be clear if I know what I'm talking about for sure or not, but most aren't. That leads to even more misinformation floating around. Hell, in this very thread alone you have posters saying "this is the way to go" and "this is how it will work," when no one but Bort could possibly know and everything else is pure conjecture (not counting the specifics of how the training system will work). A lack of reliable info on the basics of how things work is a HUGE problem in this game, IMO. Hell, I can't even find an answer to how far in advance you have to adjust the AIs in order for them to apply for the next game.



This was in the main announcement that has been clearly communicated to everyone.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=1003451

Originally posted by Bort

New items
- When you visit the store, 3 items that are level and class appropriate are randomly generated. You don't have to buy them. They will stick around until you "refresh" the store or choose to buy one.



 
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Originally posted by islander1
Adding advanced gear won't make anyone more unique or different. It'll simply change what the min-maxers go for. A temporary patch on a permanent problem MMORPG's have had for decades


MMORPGs aren't decades old...
 
PP
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Originally posted by thehazyone
Originally posted by PP

Originally posted by hud



Sorry no quote, but he did say that the level of your player affected what kind of equipment came up in the store.


Thanks for clearing that up. The fact that I didn't know this is a huge prob, IMO. I know that there are players that spend way more time scouring the forums than I do, but there are 10000-100000000 more that spend far less time. I try pretty damn hard to find and piece together everything Bort has to say about this game, and still was way off base on that. When I answer ?s, I try to be clear if I know what I'm talking about for sure or not, but most aren't. That leads to even more misinformation floating around. Hell, in this very thread alone you have posters saying "this is the way to go" and "this is how it will work," when no one but Bort could possibly know and everything else is pure conjecture (not counting the specifics of how the training system will work). A lack of reliable info on the basics of how things work is a HUGE problem in this game, IMO. Hell, I can't even find an answer to how far in advance you have to adjust the AIs in order for them to apply for the next game.



This was in the main announcement that has been clearly communicated to everyone.

http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=1003451

Originally posted by Bort


New items
- When you visit the store, 3 items that are level and class appropriate are randomly generated. You don't have to buy them. They will stick around until you "refresh" the store or choose to buy one.






I agree. I dropped the ball on that one. For me, anyway, the problem is that Bort info can be found everywhere. I try to piece so many nuggets found (and missed) in so many different locations that I suffer brain freeze from it some times. I think it would be a huge help (for me at least) in both digesting and finding info if it was all found in one location and put together in a logical fashion.

Bort's long post about the changes that you quoted from was great, but then you have to pick through 122 more pages to get clarifications. By the time I'm done, my brain tends to turn to jello. That was the point of the post of mine that you quoted.
 
Bort
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Originally posted by Asheme
I don't think the training updates should imply that Bort isn't working on/concerned with other issues, not in the least.


I agree...I don't see why people think that I release something and that means "I'm done, never doing anything else. Sorry!"

ANYWAY...the new gear can be better than the old gear once you upgrade it, but it can also be worse. It all depends on how you use it. You're not going to get a +5 or +6 item like you can at lv 32 or lv 40 through cash upgrades. You might be able to find a +3 when you're high enough level and then upgrade it over a couple seasons to +5. The new stuff is focused more on getting you +1 SA's or +%'s to do stuff than raw stats.
 
thehazyone
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Originally posted by PP
Originally posted by islander1


I can only speak for my own teammates, but I've yet to hear a positive response to this 'shopping for leet gear' crap.



between the team I own, 3 I gm for and 2 other teams I work closely with (6 total), I've yet to even hear one neutral comment:
Looks like a total piece of crap to me!
Go shopping....night out on the town....what a total load of freakin BULLSHIT!!
Just my opinion of course but i don't play this game for all this kiddy crap!


My team and the teams my players are on, I haven't seen but one negative comment and tons of positive comments. I think a lot of it comes from how the upper management of the team feels. If the owner/GM's don't like it, the natural tendency will be for the rest of the team to not like it.

It's a mixed bag I think, just from reading the initial announcement thread I still feel there is a 3:2 in favor and I think the best thing to do is to actually let the season play out and see how it works. I think some of those that are so against it might be surprised. But I could be wrong (and it wouldn't be the first time, nor will it be the last).

I'm obviously a fan of the changes and this is despite the fact that it's going to take me forever to do training for the 50+ players I have. That being said, however, I really do believe that Bort needs to do something about the gutting epidemic much sooner than the next off season, but it's looking like that won't happen.
 
Asheme
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Originally posted by PP
Taking one day and going through the league, moving teams up or down, wouldn't have left the new training system in a state of half-assedness.

The half-assedness was more in regards to whatever the gutting solution would be. More has to be done than going through all the leagues and moving teams around. That's a one-shot deal, that would inevitably cause a lot of anger/frustration, and would do nothing to stop the problem at its root. Whatever the solution to gutting will be, it'll have to be comprehensive. All I'm saying is I'd rather get these things (training/fame/etc.) that were already mostly done out of the way, rather than Bort running around making a series of reactionary changes.

Some people take this as a sign that his priorities are off, I see it as he's got he guts to follow through on something he started a while ago, and knows better than to try and appease with knee-jerk solutions. I find that encouraging tbh

Purehatred is right, these changes have been in the works since the end of season 1. I know Bort has a priority list and, sometimes, the thing that's closest to being done takes priority over what may be a more pressing, but also more complex, issue, that deserves more than merely a band-aid solution.
Last edited Sep 15, 2008 13:38:15
 
thehazyone
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I've said this before... the biggest problem imo is that Bort can only do so much. He's taking on too much and because he can only do one massive roll out per off season (and he's been very good at doing this), things that don't get implemented cause a massive storm of whining and complaining that such and such didn't get done.

I still think Bort needs to hire someone to assist him with programming, but I also know how sensitive he might be to giving someone access to the code and touching his "baby". Patience on everyone's part would help, the problem with this is that when people pay money they feel they have the right to not have to be patient (and I understand this).

I'm sure that Bort will continue to work hard on implementing the changes that the majority (and sometimes the minority) want, but because he is only one person there is only so much that he can do. This in my opinion is the biggest problem at hand.
 
PP
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I'm comming off in all of this as if I HATE the new training system. In reality, I don't. Frankly, until it's put into action, I don't know enough about it to hate or love it. What I hate is the lack of info that I can use to base the decisions I have coming up extremely swiftly on it.

What would be a second is that I do think this shouldn't have been a top priority. Yes, this has been suggested/talked about for a long time. Anyone remember Bort's gutting thread? Where he asked for ideas on how to stop it? I'd say that originated about the same time. Of the 2, I think the gutting is a FAR more serious issue and one that is currently causing teams to fold at an alarming rate, as well as sucking the fun out of many leagues (AAA#2 East, 7 Ws handed to any team that's not gutted...where's the fun for either side on that one?). Sure, hand shifting teams is a one shot, quick fix. My question would be, if he hasn't been working on that problem all along as well, why have the thread on it asking for suggestions? I sure would hate to think that is was just a feel good act to make players believe that he did indeed care about the problem.

My opinion is that is a far more important issue. Apparently, his and others are that training is. We're each entitled to think what we want....BTW, no owner in any of those forums that I quoted gave any indication of whether they liked it or not....They were player threads. As I said, I don't know enough personally to know one way or the other


Finally, Bort, thank you for answering. That helps a ton right there. One thing I a still a little unclear on is if the new EQ is meant to be held onto for the long haul (like the current EQ is) or if it is more designed to be purchased at each major upgrade break (ie. Buy 4 pieces at lvl 16, upgrade them at 24, 32, 40 and so on OR buy 4 pieces at lvl 16, buy 4 different pieces at 24, 4 more at 32, 40 and so on)?
 
Drewg81
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Originally posted by thehazyone
I've said this before... the biggest problem imo is that Bort can only do so much. He's taking on too much and because he can only do one massive roll out per off season (and he's been very good at doing this), things that don't get implemented cause a massive storm of whining and complaining that such and such didn't get done.

I still think Bort needs to hire someone to assist him with programming, but I also know how sensitive he might be to giving someone access to the code and touching his "baby". Patience on everyone's part would help, the problem with this is that when people pay money they feel they have the right to not have to be patient (and I understand this).

I'm sure that Bort will continue to work hard on implementing the changes that the majority (and sometimes the minority) want, but because he is only one person there is only so much that he can do. This in my opinion is the biggest problem at hand.


People have a full view of what the game is before they pay money. They can sign up for free and choose to pay. There is no promise by Bort or any other developer to get things released by a certain time, and multiple mentions of this being in it's Beta stages all over the site.

People might think they have the right to be impatient, but until Bort breaks his own terms of service, they don't have the right to jack shit.


And Hazy, you know this isn't directed towards you at all. It's towards all the people who feel that they are entitled to a finished product when they clearly bought into it unfinished.
 
Rage Kinard
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The way I look at it

Train on intense until you are either level 24 or level 32, because the extra SPs are worth more at lower levels and Bort has said equipment will be "level appropriate" and can not be upgraded with cash alone. In my mind that means the special equipment offered to a level 32 player will be better than the special equipment offered to a level 8 player. (In other words, I am thinking a level 32 player can get a +4 or +5 piece of equipment with a %bonus where a level 8 could only get a +1 or +2 piece with a % bonus. Also, it will cost 2.5 permanent sp plus cash to upgrade a piece of special equipment.
 
purehatred
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Originally posted by Bort

I agree...I don't see why people think that I release something and that means "I'm done, never doing anything else. Sorry!"


balloons = lazy imo

 
Nixx
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Originally posted by PP
Bort's long post about the changes that you quoted from was great, but then you have to pick through 122 more pages to get clarifications. By the time I'm done, my brain tends to turn to jello. That was the point of the post of mine that you quoted.


Well actually I posted in the Bort stalker thread a post that has all of Borts replies in the announcement thread: http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=1003451&page=60#7883808

He also answered some questions in the 'intense training sucks' thread: http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=1020662&page=24#7988678

I'm not saying these are perfect, but at least there are places to find most of Borts replies instead of going through 122 pages.
 
purehatred
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Originally posted by Asheme
I know Bort has a priority list and, sometimes, the thing that's closest to being done takes priority over what may be a more pressing, but also more complex, issue, that deserves more than merely a band-aid solution.


Originally posted by PP
What would be a second is that I do think this shouldn't have been a top priority.


I think the main problem is that there are a group of people that don't agree with Bort's list of priorities.

So it's essentially a matter of opinion...in that case, let's guive Bort the benefit of the doubt, huh?
 
1VBChaos
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Originally posted by Drewg81
People have a full view of what the game is before they pay money. They can sign up for free and choose to pay. There is no promise by Bort or any other developer to get things released by a certain time, and multiple mentions of this being in it's Beta stages all over the site.

People might think they have the right to be impatient, but until Bort breaks his own terms of service, they don't have the right to jack shit.


And Hazy, you know this isn't directed towards you at all. It's towards all the people who feel that they are entitled to a finished product when they clearly bought into it unfinished.


Actually - and in part due to the secrecy surrounding the game - it takes quite some time to get a 'full view' of this game. It also often takes being a GM, rather than just a player to even start to appreciate the failings in the AI system and team ownership side of things.

And it's not about impatience either - some of the fundamental complaints far outdate the training thing - and how many more seasons must people put up with seeing multiple accounts that never get dealt with, despite it being a bit of a running joke when the same multiple account holders come back in their latest guise?

As for rights - well, therein lies a problem. OK - it's a 'game under develeopment' (I refuse to say Beta - as any Beta tester will testify - this game is NOT being beta tested in any recognisable way) - but it's still taking in large sums of money. Couple that with the percieved 'Hey - we've got your cash now - so if you don't like the game, then leave' attitude that's historically permeated around the place and you have a recipe for problems.

I STILL think this game has huge potential and promise - but I can honestly say that I won't be playing beyond the next season if it carries on the 'WoW' route. I will continue to recycle my flex as I am currently doing - but my continued playing of this game has as much to do with the 'car crash TV' phenomenom than anything else.......you know you REALLY want to turn away, but something just keeps you wanting to keep watching, even though you're only watching for something bad to happen.........

It's wrong, but it's still intriguing.........

 
PP
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Originally posted by Nixx
Originally posted by PP

Bort's long post about the changes that you quoted from was great, but then you have to pick through 122 more pages to get clarifications. By the time I'm done, my brain tends to turn to jello. That was the point of the post of mine that you quoted.


Well actually I posted in the Bort stalker thread a post that has all of Borts replies in the announcement thread: http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=1003451&page=60#7883808

He also answered some questions in the 'intense training sucks' thread: http://goallineblitz.com/game/forum_thread.pl?thread_id=1020662&page=24#7988678

I'm not saying these are perfect, but at least there are places to find most of Borts replies instead of going through 122 pages.


I'd found those, Nixx...It was after I'd already waded through I can't remember how many pages, but that's still beyond awesome that you did that. Unfortunately, now someone will have to wade through 10 pages of this thread to get Bort's one golden nugget.

I understand his dilemma with that. I face it myself. Every time I do a certain project, I'm under the gun to get it done and waste 30-60 mins going through images to find the ones I need. I know that I could cut that time down to 5-10 mins, but it would take me over a day to reorganize my system. Because I'm strapped for time each time the problem rears its ugly head, I don't have time to do it then, and then don't want to later...It's just frustrating.
 
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